Look on YouTube for Don Brusters NGO (Agape International
Missions.) He says 100 westerners a day come into Svay Pak because it's known for its
very young girls being trafficked. They have rescues several (as young as 3 years old.) Or you can just google Don Bruster Cambodia.

hey floating,
i dont know whether or not somaly's claims are true because i wasnt there that day in 2004, but it wouldnt be the first time a government falsely denied wrongdoing either. just because the UN denies something, doesnt necessarily mean anything either way. they could be incorrect or lying or they could be telling the truth. somaly could be crazy, or she could be 100 percent correct. me and you will never know, because we werent there. it is pretty important to be objective rather than partial when all the facts arent available. it wouldnt be the first time the UN has been wrong, and it wouldnt be the first time somaly has been either, you know?

thanks lovethosegrdkids-11 i will check don bruster out.

The article in the cambo daily yesterday was good and helps to confirm what a lot of people have been saying for years. This wont change your mind trapper as I think its closed.

Trapper,

I know you are well meaning individual, but you are revealing your ignorance of Cambodia when you make claims like this.

LICADHO, the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights office, these are the people that would be making a BIG deal out of this if it were true. They are human rights advocates and anti-trafficking activists. The US embassy is really into anti-trafficking. So if they are denying it, you can be sure they are telling the truth.

Then there was an article from Monday in the Cam Daily in which the founder of AFESIP, forerunner to Somaly Mam Foundation, denied that there was ever any killing as well. In addition, he also points out that Somaly apparently previously claimed that their daughter was kidnapped in 2006 related to trafficking- which he also says was a lie.

"Ms Mam said in an email that she was traveling to Bangkok for a medical checkup and could not comment on what she had told the UN panel". Well, that's convenient.

Honestly, I'm shocked that she would tell such a blatant lie.

Pick up the Cambodia Daily from Monday and read it- should be easy to find at one of the roadside vendors.

If you continue to deny it when someone made this painfully clear to you then the guilt is on you.

PS, I think lovethosegrdkids may be trying to point out another NGO that is making false claims, but not sure... let's wait for them to come back and clarify.

Floating- I dont believe Don Bruster and his NGO is making false claims. He has brought some of the girls to the US to testify against these Pedophiles. My question to you is...." why are you in denial about what is taking place in Cambodia?" I suppose that Americas Most Wanted is also making false claims?

http://www.somaly.org/news/cambodian-royal-gendarmerie-builds-investigat...

Like I told trapper before the hub of trafficking is in Thailand....This has just come in this morning.

Police Free 23 in Trafficking Raid
2012-04-24

Thai police liberate a group of Burmese trafficking victims forced to work on a fishing vessel.

Thai police have detained six suspected human traffickers and rescued nearly two dozen of their Burmese victims who were forced to work on a fishing vessel under ‘slave-like’ conditions, according to rights groups and victims.

The police, accompanied by rights activists, raided a house in Achaung, in eastern Thailand’s Chonburi coastal province, at around 3:00 a.m. on Friday and found the 23 Burmese men victims, some of whom had been believed held for more than a year.

One of the victims, 16-year-old Maung Ayok from Zalotgyi village in Pegu division’s Htandabin township, escaped while the boat loaded cargo at port in Thailand. He contacted the Burmese Association in Thailand (BAT), a rights group which monitors Burmese migrants in the country, which then notified Thai authorities, leading to the raid.

Held during the police action were four suspected traffickers, while another two Burmese men linked to the smuggling syndicate were detained in Bangkok, based on information from the trafficking victims.

Two ethnic Mon women from Burma were among the traffickers arrested in the boat raid, according to reports.

Most of the victims are from ethnic Burmese groups, including the Karen minority, from Pegu division, who had crossed the Thai border near Mae Sot with the assistance of brokers to look for work. Several of them had been passed on to the fishing boat operator in the coastal town of Mahachai on their way to Bangkok.

At least three of those rescued were just 16 years old, reports said.
‘Slave-like’ conditions

One worker showed RFA’s Burmese service the conditions he had to endure during his siege.

“I was locked up in this room while two guards stayed outside. We were taken out only to work on the boat, and then locked up again after we were done. We didn't get paid at all,” he said.

Another described how he had been taken advantage of by fellow Burmese who had sold him into slavery.

“I was sold from one trafficker to another by our own countrymen, not by the Thai boat owner. It is only our countrymen who are involved in this ring,” he said.

Another man, who had traveled to Mahachai from Bangkok, said he had been kidnapped on the way and sold by a trafficker to the boat operators.

Kyaw Thaung, a member of BAT, was quoted by Burmese exile news group The Irrawaddy as saying that the trafficking victims had lived in conditions better suited to animals and that few of them had more than one set of dirty clothing.

“They were locked up the whole time and watched by two guards,” he said.

Six of the victims are being housed in Thailand’s Nonthaburi province and the rest are being sheltered at an office to combat human trafficking in Bangkok. The victims may have to wait three to four months for Thai courts to investigate and prosecute the traffickers before returning to Burma.

The U.S. State Department’s annual Human Rights report lists Thailand as a source, transit, and destination for victims of human trafficking for a variety of purposes, including work at factories.

Human trafficking is common in southern Thailand where Burmese migrants are commonly snatched up by trafficking gangs to work on the boats of the large fishing industry—often for months at little or no pay.

About 200,000 to 450,000 people are trafficked annually in the Greater Mekong subregion, which includes southern China, Laos, Burma, Thailand, Cambodia, and Vietnam, the countries joined by the Mekong River, according to the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime.

http://www.rfa.org/english/news/burma/raid-04242012150209.html

No doubt that it is on a much higher scale in Thailand. Its a much larger country. However, if only one is being trafficked, regardless if it be sex trafficking or other forms of trafficking, it's one to many. We need to do all we can to help in that area. Gandhi said, “Be the change you wish to see in the world.” We cannot save the world, but we can make a difference.... one person....one child at a time.

no trafficking here,go to thailand,se asian headquarters for trafficting,or better still go home and get a fucking job

lovethosegrandkids...

I'm not in denial that there is some trafficking in Cambodia, especially of adults, and probably more trafficking for labor than is generally recognized, and probably more trafficking of men than is generally recognized.

I just think that some NGOs may be taking advantage of the fact that there is not much in the way of reliable figures, to make us all feel that sex trafficking in incredibly widespread, when it's not. They are taking advantage of the foreign media's need for something sensational, something sexy, to get funds which may be out of proportion to the real needs, especially when balanced with other needs in Cambodia.

There are other less sexy problems which could also use some attention. Trapper could also consider working on one of those.

I just want people to think about this more critically and not believe all the hype.

America's most wanted: I'm not familiar with what you're talking about. You are welcome to explain.

Another article in the Cambodia Daily today in which the former consultant at AFESIP also denies Somaly Mam's claim that her daughter was kidnapped.

If I was trapper, I would consider another organization (like maybe Agape) that has more credibility.

There's also a common tendency to confuse voluntary labor migration with human trafficking. In the last few days there were several articles about a couple who were arrested for "trafficking". Apparently they transported people to Poipet, but it wasn't clear from the article whether the people who were transported wanted to be transported or not. If they went voluntarily, it's not trafficking. The justice system in this country can also be unfair to the alleged perpetrators, which is something that people (in hysteria) may overlook.

Re: your link to Somaly Mam and the Royal Gendarmerie- so what? Does that somehow excuse her blatantly lying?

I still think it's better to support organizations that are credible, and don't lie in order to whip up hysteria. If there's a trafficking problem according to objective, factual information, then the funding will be there. It's not necessary to make stuff up.

Basically she lied about the 8 girls being murdered.

Exactly!

There are plenty of other anti-trafficking operations around, better to support one of them...

Floating-Glad you clarified, I was concerned. However, I do believe it is a major problem in Cambodia as well. I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. As far as Somally Mam is concerned if she is lying to gain financial support for herself... then shame on her. Although I did google her and found nothing discriminating. Perhaps because of her stance someone is just trying to destroy her. Not sure! Keith needs to have his mouth washed out with soap, his remark was uncalled for.

GP

^

Her book is a great piece of fiction.

She will destroy her own reputation. It will not matter anyhow as she will be safely ensconced in her expensive mansion in the USA.

I wonder where the money to purchase it came from?

I agree about keith... No need for what he said.

Oh but Thailand is so big, so cosmopolitan, so westernized.
So much harder to find the delightful residences, bijou boutiques, trendy eats, and of course a like-minded social scene than in Ville-Charmant.
Are there any stats on the resources deployed in the two countries relative to the size of the issue?
No doubt there's still a child-sex problem, but Cambodia seems to have become overinflated with people tackling it, relative to, well, perhaps just about anywhere else, let alone what the perceived size of the problem is relative to the reality, etc.

I have said for a long time there are more Pedophile chasers in Cambodia than Pedophiles. I'm talking about Western Pedophiles, Asian Pedophiles is another matter.
One Pedo is one too many.

love those grdkids-11,

you say you think it is a major problem... are you talking about child sex trafficking, sex trafficking, or trafficking in general? or labor trafficking?

I respect your opinion that it is a major problem, although "major" could have many meanings.

In any case, I will assume you mean sex trafficking. Can you provide any evidence that it is a major problem? Have you read the survey (Steinfatt et al) that I provided a link to earlier?

I am genuinely interested in this question, so if you can prove to me that it is more prevalent than in the study I provided a link to, please do so.

The Cambodia Daily article does not indicate that someone is trying to destroy her reputation. She made a statement herself in front of the UN General Assembly. Her claim was denied by just about everyone involved in human trafficking in Cambodia. And is general knowledge for those of us who have been around that long. As for the claim that her daughter was kidnapped, two different people with intimate knowledge of the situation have said its not true- her ex-husband/ former director of AFESIP, and the former consultant at AFESIP at that time.

Believe what you want but it seems she's just exaggerating to get more attention. It's probably hard when you become less of a star because the problem you are working on has been addressed somewhat and so just doesn't get the attention it used to. But these are things we just have to accept and that's not a good reason to lie.

I would like to see trapper get involved in the fight against illegal logging,along with somaly mam.

why marklatham?

Hi, I was just checking your site, and wondering about your budget, does it really cost $30 a month for every girl at your center to receive medical care.. ?what sort of 'medical care' is this.. also many of the other figures suggest a lifestyle with you that does not compare to actual figures for many people living outside a large city in Cambodia. Can you tell me where I can find more info on your accounting, balance sheets etc. I take it your organization is tax exempt in the US as a charity. I am wondering how your finances are, and if you currently are running a profit, and what the money outside of your facility in Cambodia is used for. such as salaries, Travel and accommodation expenses for your international staff etc.

here is the excerpt from your site..

WHAT CAN YOUR MONEY DO?
Your money can do a lot! Here are some examples how as little as $30 a month can defeat child sex-trafficking!
$30 p/mo = medical care for one ARC girl
$50 p/mo = educational material for ATC
$100 p/mo = medical care to all the Cambodian staff at Rahab’s House
$350 p/mo = rent for the Agape Training Center
$2000 p/mo = food for girls at Agape Training Center
$5,000 = keeps the Lord’s Gym open for 1 year or covers the annual salary for 1 teacher at ARC
$10,000 = one month of school lunches for 400 students or the cost of healthcare equipment at Rahabs House for 1 year
$80,000 = runs Rahab’s house in Seim Reap for one year
$400,000 = runs Agape Restoration Center for one year

FINANCIAL INFORMATION
Agape International Missions (AIM) is a 501c3 non-profit corporation, incorporated in the State of California on August 1, 1988. EIN # is 94-3100052. Since 1989 it has been working in the Kingdom of Cambodia and currently has Memorandums of Understanding with the Ministry of Interior, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, the Ministry of Social Affairs, the Ministry of Education, and the Ministry of Religions and Cults.

Financial accountability is provided by AIM’s Board of Directors and the Board Finance Committee. The Finance committee includes the Corporate Treasurer, the Secretary of the Board, and the Executive Director. The Finance Committee oversees the three main functions of the finance team; Donations and Deposits, Disbursements, and Reconcilement. Each functional area is managed by different individuals to ensure separation of duties. Reconcilement of both the US and Cambodia accounts and expenditures is provided by a hired outside bookkeeper on a monthly basis.

The funds are held in the United States at a federally insured bank. AIM’s Executive Director makes monthly wire transfer requests based upon AIM’s board approved budget. AIM’s treasurer and Disbursement Manager review the request before approving it and wire the approved funds to Cambodia. At the end of each month the Executive Director provides a detailed report of all expenses, including corresponding receipts. AIM budgets and expense reports are available to anyone upon request.

---

also you are stating that there are visitors seeking to exploit children every day in your area, however your video material only reflects one such case. Do you have any more evidence of what really happens in that regard, and how many pedophile westerners you actually have these fake negotiations with?

I think don brusters is a liar like somaly mam.Is there anything at svay pak nowadays-I dont think so.
And the biggest red light district in the world-where on earth is this?
The lies and exaggerations are getting way out of control now.
These people are becoming parodies of themselves,arent they?

Hey Trapper if your still around.

Why do you wish to get involved in anti child sex trafficking?

hi banker,
i want to get involved in anti-child sex trafficking because these girls and boys need whoever they can get in their corner. i think there is nothing better that a person can do with their life than to help children and protect them from abuse. and i think that there is no worse form of abuse existing in our world today than child sex trafficking. if i get involved in this and i only manage to save 1 girl my entire life then i will never regret my decision. last week i came across a girl in Steung Mean Chey village that was close to death. now she is in a private hospital getting the treatment she needs and hopefully she will survive. even if she is doesnt, at least now she will not die on the floor of the man's house i found her in. even for that one girl i will never regret coming to cambodia. people tell me on here to go home...well this is one reason why i will stay.

Well I wish you the very best of luck, but please remember you will get disappointed from time to time.

thank you banker. you are right and i do realize this. i will have to live with that

Do you really think CNN would feature Don Bruster if he was a liar? Don't you think they check them out first?

http://origincoffee.org/uncategorized/cnn-features-rahabs-house

Way to go Trapper! To stay home and send 3,000 dollars a month to employ Cambodians in crazy. We have personally seen what happens.

TJP,
here is the answer to your questions. (1) i was alone when i came across this girl. it was me and a translator that i paid to come with me to the village. (2) nobody can communicate with this girl. she doesnt speak at all to anybody, cambodian or otherwise. she is catatonic. (3) i understood exactly what was going on as i had a very good translator with me. (4) i found my way to this village by myself. Steung MeanChey is not hard to find, its actually quite well known.(5) i was led to the house by one of the village men that i was sitting talking with, thru my translator. the girl was living at his boarding house, in a corner of the main entrance, on the floor. he asked me to come help her. (6) i was with no "experienced or knowledgeable" people, cambodian or otherwise. yes it would have been great to have some such people with me at the time, but that is not the way it worked out. (7) i didnt bring any indispensible skill or knowledge to this rescue. i had two eyes to see that Sarin was in trouble, cared enough about her that i wanted to help her and had the money to take her to a hospital right away. that was enough this time. (8 ) i wasnt a burden to my cambodian colleagues, as i had no colleagues with me. (9) my translator needed to explain to me what was going on, but thats what hes paid for, and he only needed to explain once, as the situation would be pretty clear to anyone that has eyes. (10) no my translator did not need to explain to anyone what a foreigner was even doing there as i had been invited to be there by the man who lived there.

so i have answered all of your questions. if i have written anything anywhere to deserve being called a self aggrandizing white savior then please tell me exactly the words i said to deserve being called that. otherwise why would you say that about me when you have never even met me? you sound like a smart person. respectfully, you must know what it looks like when someone speaks about something they dont really know about. i am only someone trying to help some people, where i can. i am no savior. i am nothing special, as you pointed out.

Here's another video by NBC News a 2003 investigation. There are many more I could post.

Trapper yes can meet when we arrive in Cambodia in July. If your a male than my husband would come with me. I too am interested in rescue and have been in contact with Don Brewster and he put me in contact wih Chab Dai in Phnom Penh since that is where we will live.

GP

ok sounds good, GP. we will keep in touch until then. thank you.

News from 2003. Bound to reflect the current reality.

Trapper,

I have been here in Cambodia for the past 18 months working towards opening a center for former sex workers (trafficked or otherwise) I have been coming here for the past 5 years and have learned very much in that time.

We all come to Cambodia a little naive, believing what the media or the rescue industry propaganda have told us and we all get our eyes opened fast to reality. Of course there is still trafficking going on here! I have good friends who have come through that hell and are making the best path they can for themselves now. I also have friends who feel fulfilled for now in a "professional girlfriend" life. I have also witnessed lies and corruption in many organizations I have been involved with.

Yes, you may be just learning what is going on in Cambodia and where you can best fulfill your desire to make a difference in the world. I too have seen many doing more harm then good in that desire but I really don't understand the tone of the comments on this thread. I fail to see why people feel it is appropriate to speak to you online in a way that they would never speak if they met you in person.

I would be happy to meet with you and share what I have learned. Feel free to contact me at banteaysreyproject [at] gmail [dot] com

Trapper, Queen etc - I wish you well in trying to save some Cambodian children at risk. As you say Trapper, saving even one child is worth it. My wife and I have also saved one young child and everyone we know, Khmer or Western, supports us.

There are many cynical people here for many reasons. Credible studies show no evidence of the sorts of trafficking quoted by many NGOs to get funding. Why? You need to be aware of the motives of these people. How is that some have big houses and pools , not only in Cambodia but overseas. OK, they've saved some children, no doubt, but what's their ulterior motive. Why do they have to lie? Do they think that their comfortable lifestyle will disappear if they don't get the funds?

By all means do what your heart tells you. Go and save as many kids as you can. Don't ever do it for self aggrandisement - you have said this also.

But, my biggest problem with all of this is the corrupt elite. They don't give a f#&k about anything, least of all the people of this country. And their stupid rich brat children are going to make it worse.

It'd be great if you could continue to update the forum on what you find. But please keep an open mind on everything you see and hear here. Trust me, the favourite sport for many Khmers is to screw the foreigner. Your biggest challenge is to find someone you can trust with your life in this sort of work. I can honestly say that in my previous work and family situation now, that I have found only a small handfull of people whom I could ever trust fully.

Good luck

Well, folks, I don't work for an NGO and I'm not the sort who goes around trying to save the world ... and I have spent more than my fair share of time here in Cambodia mixing with the less savory elements of society, both Khmer and expat, and I think I've got a pretty decent handle on what's going down around town. I don't claim to know everything, but the seedy side of things tends to be my element, I was just raised wrong I guess.

Child sex trafficking? Yeah, it does occur, but I don't think it's quite as organized as you're imagining. It isn't really big business. There aren't enough pedophiles - i.e. customers - out there to fuel some huge epidemic. Even if they pay a big premium for it. They'd all go broke sooner or later, right? Unless pedophiles as a demographic somehow happen to be wealthier and more successful than the rest of the burn-out sexpats who, to their credit, at least go with adults. Too much risk for the Khmer pimp, too much hassle recruiting clients, not enough money involved on a steady basis. I'd say it's a very, very niche market or maybe even a crime of opportunity - enough cash is laid on the table, and so the procurer go gets a hold of a vulnerable kid he has access to. That kind of villainy.

Sure, there are some absolute scum who'll sell anything or anybody to anyone given the chance, and so it goes down like that I suppose. I'm guessing a lot more kids (population adjusted) are getting molested in America every day than in Cambodia. I'm also guessing that a lot more Cambodian kids are getting molested by adult Cambodians than by western perverts roaming from country to country to indulge their monstrous predations. That's the pattern everywhere else in the world - abusers tend to be close to their victims.

I've only ever been approached by one guy, motodop, asking if I wanted "small girls," and my response was to ask him if he wanted a fucking broken nose, and I kept walking. But even then, my assumption is that the guy wasn't actually pimping some little kid - he was just looking for some barang pervert to con, same as if he had fake dope or whatever. Or it was a set-up, bring you somewhere, get a cop involved, empty your bank account at the ATM or you find yourself (quite deservedly in this case) huddled on the floor of a cell in Prey Sar. He'd make a hell of a lot more money running a racket like that than he would by doing a straight deal.

So, sure, by all means - stop whatever child trafficking you discover, of course. But don't go looking for boogeymen standing on every Riverside corner. There might be a few now and then, but my instincts are telling me that it's a rarity, an exception not the rule. Like serial killers, right? Yeah, they exist. They are dangerous as hell, really disturbing, very frightening. But they aren't the number one scourge of society; the greatest threat to civilization, whatever. And neither are the horrible few weirdos who might show up in Cambodia and victimize kids - they should be stopped, but it isn't the biggest issue here either.

If they were out there in droves, I'd have had the displeasure of meeting some of the bastards, I'm sure. People will admit to anything after enough beers, and I've heard everything up to murder confessions, but nobody so far giving me a wink and asking if I know any 4th Graders up for a good time, thank fucking christ.

You know who else needs help? All of the kids living in dire poverty, abused or not. Or all of the girls from the provinces who end up in hostess bars trading their dignity for $30 a night. They might not be cute and innocent kids anymore I guess, but a 20 year old who feels compelled to whore herself out to survive or "help her family" sounds like a possible victim to me.

And you know who owns all of those hostess bars? Generals, Ministers, political elites. I know one Khmer guy who runs 10 of them for a General, and none of them appear to be connected to each other at all - just different spots strung out along Riverside, but all lining a General's pockets. Most of those establishments are like that - with middle-men running like a dozen places or whatever, on behalf of one of Hun Sen's cronies. (Yes, there are some "independent" establishments as well. They pay bribes to stay in business, but if their place makes too much money they risk getting shook-down and taken over by the big boys).

Come to think of it: if there was any real money to be made in child sex trafficking, and it was a booming business, a plague upon Cambodian society, we'd know right away because all of the Khmer elites in the government and military would be running gigantic brothels filled with kids, and probably calling them orphanages or something. I wish I was joking.

curios as to what ever happened to trapper

Good post NK OK but way off the mark in someways,again.What is the obsession with the Riverside?
Just because it is where the tourists go, so the ignorant see the hostess bars and think that it is the centre of the sex industry? I dont think Generals own many hostess bars, thats ridiculous.They own huge KTVs and X2s where the real action takes place- this is Khmer culture.And one can also blame the greedy mama and family in the bush extorting money from the daughters - Khmer culture again.
As for K 11, it closed down in the mid nineties but dishonest and lazy journos continue to pretend that it still exists.

Hey Expat Admin. Im back in my home country, saving enough money to get back to Cambodia. This time I will have an English Teaching diploma in case i need to make money teaching and an organization there has offered me a job with them locating underage girls. Thanks for askin.

A job locating underage girls?
That wont look too good on the CV! A poor choice of words considering.....

dtm and marklatham, I just saw your comments on my old post. Yes, I meant "minority" not "majority." Poor proofreading on my part.

As for anyone who says theyhave been rescuing girls from westerners in Svay Pak recently, that is very strange considering the brothels in that area were pretty effectively shut down by 2004. I have not even heard rumors of it operating again.

As for CNN or any other news show checking their info-NO THEY ABSOLUTELY DO NOT. I know of three different people who have been involved as subjects of such programs, two in a positive light and one negative, and not only did the producers make no attempt to check the facts, they actively avoided speaking to people who wanted to tell them they were being lied to. Impartial investigative journalism, at least by TV networks, no longer seems to exist.

So do you want to fight, or save victims?
Wanting to fight is always the wrong reason, and says more about you than your convictions.
You could join these guys:
http://www.khmer440.com/chat_forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=30513